Today on the How We Can Heal Podcast, Lisa Danylchuk, and Rha Goddess discuss society's relationship with money, the issue with Capitalism, and paving the way to a successful and fulfilling life. The entrepreneurial soul coach helps us better understand ourselves with her unique methodology.
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About Rha Goddess:
Rha Goddess is the entrepreneurial soul coach behind hundreds of breakthrough changemakers, cultural visionaries and social entrepreneurs. From multiple NY Times Bestsellers to multi-million dollar social enterprises, Rha’s unique methodology has empowered a new generation of conscious entrepreneurs to stay true, get paid, and do good. From the onset of her more than 30-year career as a cultural innovator, social impact strategist and creative change agent, Rha has drawn on the power of creativity, culture and community to move hearts, minds and policy.
Rha’s book, The Calling (St. Martin’s Press) leverages her unique methodology into a step by step blueprint for finding your purpose and making your most profitable contribution.
Outline of the episode:
- [5:04] Awareness of money
- [11:02] Rha’s story of chasing money from a funder
- [20:13] When Rha took her relationship with money back
- [22:50] Viability and sustainability for nonprofits
- [31:11] Our relationship with money
- [36:46] 6 Root Causes
- [38:08] Society and scarcity
- [48:27] Paving the way to success
- [52:27] I've got issues with Capitalism
- [01:03:40] Moving our dollars in alignment with our values
- [01:15:27] What gives Rha hope
Resources:
Website: www.movethecrowd.me
The Calling: https://www.movethecrowd.me/the-calling
Instagram: @rhagodess
Facebook: @truepaidgood
Rha’s TedTalk: https://www.ted.com/speakers/rha_goddess
Transcription:
Rha Goddess 0:00
You know, because I know what the center of this conversation is really about money is to take back our relationship. We define our relationship with source because the resource is an extension of source
Lisa Danylchuk 0:23
Welcome, everyone. Our guest today is Rha Goddess. Rha Goddess is the entrepreneurial soul coach behind hundreds of breakthrough changemakers cultural visionaries and social entrepreneurs from multiple New York Times best sellers to multimillion-dollar social enterprises. Rha's unique methodology has empowered a new generation of conscious entrepreneurs to stay true, get paid, and do good. From the onset of her more than 30-year career as a cultural innovator, social impact strategist and creative change agent RA has drawn on the power of creativity, culture, and community to move hearts minds, and policy. Rha's book, The calling by St. Martin's Press, leverages her unique methodology into a step-by-step blueprint for finding your purpose and making your most profitable contribution. Rha and I connected through Gabby Bernstein, who was the first guest on this podcast. I recently dove into Rha's course making money making change and felt it to be filled with love, possibility, and deep opportunities for healing. I am thrilled to have her as a guest here today. So let's get to it and welcome Rha to the show. Welcome back to Season Two of the How We Can Heal podcast. I so enjoyed sharing season one with you. And we have some incredible guests coming on for season two. I created this podcast because the hard times seem to just keep on coming these days. These guests and I have committed our lives to healing work and to fostering health and joy in the world. Even as we work through the impacts of trauma and face deep challenges. So let's dive in and let's all keep talking about how we can heal. All right here we are Rha Goddess, thank you so much for coming on the How We Can Heal podcast.
Rha Goddess 2:15
It is my joy, Lisa. Thank you so much for having me.
Lisa Danylchuk 2:18
I'm so so happy to have you here. I was just sharing with you Gabby's recommendation, I read your book, Making Money Making Change. And I was like, singing along with it laughing along with you like praising hallelujah. Like, I felt like you were in my head. And I know people say you know when you're writing to really connect with people, so well done there. And I also feel like there's a lot there's a lot we can talk about. So we'll start breaking that down in a minute.
Rha Goddess 2:46
Awesome. So you talked about the book The calling, and then the course the audio?
Lisa Danylchuk 2:50
Audio course. Okay, I was like audio book at least I didn't call it a book on tape.
Rha Goddess 2:56
All good all good.
Lisa Danylchuk 2:58
Right the book that calling in the course. Right? Yeah, cause you did call it a course during it now? Is it in print anywhere? Or is it only on Audible?
Rha Goddess 3:05
So book is in print. The Calling is in print and audio. But making money making changes? Is the audio course.
Lisa Danylchuk 3:12
Got it. Got it. Okay. That's why I was like, Why isn't money Making Money Making Change in your email signature, and that's why. They're, they're paired. So I've heard a little bit about your journey you share in the course and in other places, and you know, love to know everything. But I was kind of thinking like, where to start there. Because there's always so much to say right in terms of introducing your journey. And I was curious about what's your first memory of wanting to help someone.
Rha Goddess 3:42
It's interesting, I have to come at this through my parents, and their sense of who they were, and what they modeled. And my parents were born in the 1920s in this country, and I often share this you know, survived over two decades of Jim Crow segregation. Raised four kids. I am the baby. The change of life baby they had me when they were in their 40s. Which is crazy, but it's true. You're doing the math, I can see you now. But what I remember is that my mother always because of the way in which they had to fight for the most basic dignities would say there but for the grace of God go I. And instilled in us the deep, deep level. If you ever had an opportunity if you ever had a any kind of advantage, that you had a responsibility to share you had a responsibility to make a way for someone else. So it's like, when you ask me what my earliest memories is, like, I don't ever remember not wanting to help people. It was just baked into it. In the DNA of who we were given who my parents?
Lisa Danylchuk 5:04
Yeah, this is what we do. It's what we do. And so when did an awareness of money come on the scene?
Rha Goddess 5:12
I mean, certainly growing up, we were what I would consider to be lower middle class. So we all know, you know, in terms of the different waves of economy, there's a lot to be said about whether or not there is a middle class anymore. Lord knows. But I would say we were there. And so that meant that we had times when there was some money, and then we had plenty of times when there was not. And so I had that awareness. I think, in terms of the moment when I personally decided to architect a new history or create a new money narrative for myself, um, I would say is probably in my early 30s evolved. Crazy, right? But true, early 30. So I would say that very much throughout my 20s, I continued to carry the messages that came from both my parents and then all of the ways that society showed up for me, given all of the intersections of my identity, as a woman as a person of color, right, all those things, y'all. But I would say, in my early 30s, where I was, like, you know, I had gone to done an international trip. And I had, you know, there was sort of things that were sold to us about how it was going to be, you're gonna get paid for this, and you're gonna get to, you know, and then you get out there and you're like, Oh, well, actually that fell through or oh, well, actually, that didn't happen. So I came home with much less than what I thought it was going to come home with. And rent was due. And the old me the old, you know, artists activist, poverty trifecta. lining up for me, well, you know, just go out and hustle, and close the gap. And I was exhausted. And I just didn't have it in me and had to really confront that this is the way that I had been living. And, you know, it was a come to Jesus moment, right? Like, this is how, and if I wanted something different, I had to live differently, I had to create a different conversation, that then would spawn different actions when it came to me and my money.
Lisa Danylchuk 7:29
So that was, it sounds like a profound pivot point in your early 30s. And I know you've shared that you worked in nonprofits, and were there any other pivot points of pain or inspiration that stand out to you?
Rha Goddess 7:47
You know, it's interesting, because I have deep, deep love and respect for the work of nonprofit organizations, let's, let's be clear, they move mountains every single day. And they do it with nothing for many of them, you know, like, like, it's unbelievable, in my mind, all of the good that organizations are able to do with such little resources, right. And the pain of that is that we believe we come to believe because of the way we've been indoctrinated, and because of the way in which this particular sector of society organizes itself, because of the way in which our larger society operates that there is sacrifice. Deep painful sacrifice that is necessary. When you make a decision to want to do good in the world.
Lisa Danylchuk 8:51
Full body chills, as you say that it's it's a very strong belief out there. And I've worked in, I think the last nonprofit I worked in was nearby in Oakland, California, working with commercially sexually exploited youth and the work that people were doing around me and the team that I was on was doing was so important. And we were so motivated, and at times, so exhausted, like, can you take on another client, Lisa? No, like, and I can't even rally to do it. Because the thing that I'm offering that's so intangible of like listening and care and building a relationship with an entirely new human, like, I don't have it right now. So, you know, my supervisors are really kind and they would wait a couple of weeks and come back, can you take them on now? And I'd be like, like, I don't know what would give I think what will give would be the care of that person would get like, I would just be sort of hollow, like, okay, I can be your case manager. But if you actually want a relationship with me, there's this intangible force that I have an abundance of, and I pour into my work and it's, it's done right now. So like, no is the answer that question I kept coming back to my supervisors like, I'm sorry, I just can't. And eventually, they had to put someone on my caseload, and that person. It didn't have the same depth of relationship I had with the other people on my case load, because I just didn't have it. I was done. And that was maybe six months before I decided to leave that role. Because, and I mean, I realized I could live and die, and this is gonna still gonna be a problem and what how am I going to live my life? What's my angle? He tried to support, you know, this community and try to use what I've learned and leverage it, or the benefit of as many people as possible. Yeah, it's hard work out there. And it's amazing work. It's powerful. But there were moments of, of not feeling supported enough, or not having the resources because why were they asking me to take on another client? Because they needed the billable hours? Because the organization needed to keep running? And I don't blame them for that. But that's where you're saying, that's the system.
Rha Goddess 11:04
I'm saying to you. That is 100% the system? Yeah. And that that is what is deeply ingrained in the DNA. Yeah, I'll so much of the work that we do in the world. And, you know, with the movement of the fourth sector, the conversations of social enterprise and social change, we've started to make some headway in terms of inviting new models, new perspectives, new ways of thinking about building like, you can do well and do good. And I will say to you that that has to be a conscious, like, we got a ways to go in terms of people really in the mainstream, feeling like they've got access to those models, and the ability to leverage those kinds of opportunities in ways that feel viable and sustainable. Sustainability and viability even in our is new language really, you all if we want to talk about it in the context of this sector, right. But to your point, the pain, there's I mean, you know, there's, there's so much pain, I mean, I did one super quick story, and I'm actually going to share this in in in different industries, because I think it relates to everything that you're saying, I remember when I was running a not for profit, I ran it and built a not for profit, and then ran ran at that not for profit for about seven years as the executive director and and you know, 90% of your time is spent fundraising. That's just what it means to be an executive director, right, just as what it is. And I remember we got committed, we got promised by a major foundation of pretty big grant to do a body of work around women in particular, and empowering women within a very specific marginalized community. And we ramped up, right? Assuming we were going to have that money because the last words that the funder said to us was the checks were gonna be in the mail next week, you know, we're processing we're at the tail end of processing, it's coming. Y'all know these conversations, right? Some of you can feel it in your body already about where I'm going. Right? It's coming, it's in the mail. And so we Okay, great, we ramped up, we, you know, organize, we got in line, we began conversations because after all the money was coming. And about four weeks, because you know, you're polite, let's tell the truth, you all, you're starving. But you're polite, right? You're gonna wait exactly four years? I remember being in a conversation with someone. And talking about that the difference between having privilege and not having privileges, is being able to wait, having the capacity to not feel any sense of urgency around whatever the thing is, right. So, you know, donors could not get back to you two weeks ago, and they're, you know, for two weeks, and they're, their lives are unaffected, right? So but this is the this was the reality, right? But not the case for you if you're on the receiving end of that. So four weeks later, I reach out to this funder and this funder is, I'm going to tell the truth, y'all dodging me, like not returning my calls or committing to talk to me, but then pushing me to the next week at the very last minute. Oh, I had to go into the last minute. And finally, I like kind of, I'm a little surprised myself, but I did I kind of rolled up on their assistant and I was like, they need to speak to me today. Like we're in a suit, really, really serious situation. They need to speak to me today. And the funder got on the phone and said, Oh, yeah, I know. I promised you that grant and there was a situation that went down and I needed to play All, and in essence, be a good colleague. So I actually leveraged the commitment resources to this other initiative. Never bothered to pick up the phone, never bothered to communicate, like, or it could get that all of that was true. And then their response to me when I was like, jaw on the floor was, well, that's just the cost of doing business.
Lisa Danylchuk 15:25
Like my first thought is like, when did you know that? Because right, if they call you the day after they promised the check or the week after, like, there's so much in that waiting period. And like you said, the privilege, some people have the privilege to wait, some people don't and that urgency, there's, you know, a different kind of weight there. Right. That's stressful. And that's tension. And that that's hard. And so to have that consideration.
Rha Goddess 15:50
Now, it gets better. If you can, believe it or not. Oh, so through the grapevine we actually discover who this person was that they wound up rallying around and, and funding. And that person actually wound up coming to us and was like, you know, I just got this big grant. And I need to figure out how I'm going to do what I told them I was going to do and the proposal. Could you guys help me?
Lisa Danylchuk 16:26
Oh, wow.
Rha Goddess 16:31
I mean, you know what I'm saying? And, and you know, and it wasn't like, oh, we, I want to pay you? If Oh, would you be wildly to offer your free time? No. Strategically walked me through how I do this,
Lisa Danylchuk 16:46
How you were gonna do the thing that you were gonna get paid for, but now I'm getting paid for it. But I'd like you to do the work for free. Am I following?
Rha Goddess 16:53
Similar? Right? So very, very close. Right? It was a different objective addition initiative. But the idea was that they were coming for our expertise. On the heels of yes, so the world is small when these things occur, right. And so you know, and but I will say to you all, needless to say that I decided on that day, that this was not the model for me.
Lisa Danylchuk 17:15
you become so dependent on those external resources. And I think that is very disempowering over time, especially right. And it's like, if we're trying to serve people, and I think so many nonprofits have mission statements around empowerment, right around healing around supporting communities around supporting individuals around empowerment. And I think it's even more challenging to teach that or lead in that direction when you're not feeling it, right. Because you're also, you know, we're all interdependent for sure. But you're, you're leaning so hard on someone else's resources, that you don't actually have your own and feel that sense of empowerment. So I've come to understand money over time, as like a psychological resource to write like, we call it financial resources, and then oh, we'll talk about psychological resources, those are different. But just exactly what you said, then you have the privilege, you have the resources, to be able to wait to be able to be selective, to be able to choose what's right for you to be able to go ahead on that initiative, because you have the funding and you have some sense of projections or what's coming in, like we ever know, 100%, but you have enough of that, like, I have my feet under me, I feel centered. And this is where we're going together rather than Ah, I don't know, I hope it works out maybe the checks in the mail. Maybe it's not like that's very disempowering.
Rha Goddess 18:42
Yeah. 100%. And I think, you know, there's so many layers to this to this conversation, right? Because I would say to you, psychological resources, cultural resources, emotional resources, spiritual resources, right. Like there's so many elements to this. And so much of the psychology, unfortunately, around this work, comes from the place of lack comes from the place of deprivation comes from the place of, and the thing that because I think the psychological piece that you're naming Lisa is so important. The thing that I really want to underscore is the conversation of dignity. And how much we as people need dignity and that when we are deprived of dignity. That's where do you know because somebody can make a mistake, somebody can disappoint you. Somebody can let you down. Somebody can give you their word and not keep their word. But if there's any sense of remorse, if there's any sense of accountability, you're going to okay, yes, it has really repercussions, but there's still a, you acknowledge that this has an impact versus...
Lisa Danylchuk 20:08
Oh what you didn't realize, you know, whatever, you just move on with your life I'm moving on with mine like sort of dismissive
Rha Goddess 20:13
Or this feeling like you have no autonomy, you have no ability to thrive and exist. Because you're at the mercy of factors that are outside of you. And you've been conditioned to believe that this is, you know, this is wood, we're in a competition, our traditional power, and the way that the traditional paradigm of power has been set. And the way that that table has been set, is that you have been indoctrinated to believe that you are at the mercy of all these factors outside of you, which are beyond your control. And if you espouse to a belief that the universe is a dangerous place, that's a dangerous place to be. And so when I took my relationship with money back, and I want to really say it this way, you all when I took my relationship with money back when I decided that I was going to create my own narrative, I recognized that I was going to have to forge a new model, a new way of being a new way of thinking, a new way of living a new way of operating. That allowed me to remain purposeful, but to also have reverence for and recognition for my own capacity and my own sustainability, needing to be integral to any kind of purpose I'm trying to deliver or enact in the world.
Lisa Danylchuk 21:47
Yeah. So powerful. And there's, I want to dig into a little more of what you're saying, and I want to hear about your, I think, call it a transformation around your relationship with money. Is that fair? Like yeah, I'm completely different between what you described in your 20s to now. And before we go there, I'm just curious if on this nonprofit piece, do you have, like, hoping, do you have a vision of and do you see people doing things in a way that feels like, ah, that's it like, this is the direction this can go? Because I really struggled with that in the nonprofit world. You know, when you're, you're young, and you're in a career development, you're kind of like, do I want to go here? Do I want to go there, and I was just looking for it within that world. And I was like, I don't want to be the executive director of fundraising. I don't want to be the program director managing hundreds of cases for interns. Like, I just didn't see that future there. And so in terms of how they're functioning in terms of their role within society, what do you see happening? That's good.
Rha Goddess 22:51
I would say that, you know, I come back to this conversation of new models, new ways of being ways of operating. And I would say that entrepreneurial leaders who sit in non for profit seats are really, I think, the greatest hope we have of transforming, right? You know, and I would say, you know, because all nonprofits are not created equal. This is very, very true. I would also say that there are people who sit in on for profit seats who've done management courses. Who have MBAs who have gone to graduate schools who have different tools and skills, or who have different kinds of rolodexes. I mean, you know, this is really like, again, this is a this is a nuanced question, with a big answer, depending upon where you fall. But what I will say is that I do believe that in the world of social enterprise and social venture, that I think there are more entrepreneurial based solutions that are wanting to be born, and more change agents, who are really stepping inside of entrepreneurial kinds of approaches that are enabling and inviting a new chapter of viability and sustainability for the work.
Lisa Danylchuk 24:15
I love that it comes back to the viability and sustainability I think those are great, like grounding words, for those of us or folks who are feeling that that transition and looking for like, what's the flame? What's the light at the at the end of the tunnel or whatever metaphor you want to use? Like, where am I going? What's the goal? Yeah, I appreciate everything you're saying there. I'm thinking of. I used to work for another nonprofit that taught yoga in juvenile halls, called The Art of yoga project and we went to this film screening, I don't remember how it was related to the organization, maybe someone on the board was involved with it or something, but at the end of the film they had in the credits, a list of like all the nonprofit It's that the film was connected to and all the organizations that were doing this work and that work in supporting this community and that community and it just going on for, like, it felt like hours, I'm sure it was like, I don't know, 15 minutes or something goes a long time when you're sitting there watching credits, in that really impacted me at the time because I thought, wow, look like we're not alone. Right. And you know that. But I'm not like going into Google and scrolling and just looking at names of nonprofits. But now when I look back at it, I think, and this sort of, I don't know, maybe a few years after started bubbling up with me of like, how disconnected all of that is, right? Like, there's all these people in all these different groups all over the world doing all this stuff. So one of the words that comes to my mind, as you're talking to is like integration, like how do we build as social entrepreneurs? Or if there's a social venture, like, where is the, let's not reinvent the wheel? Where's the interdependence? Whereas like, think of, I don't know, a lot of things that just feel like they have more of a centrality in their force. Yeah, that makes sense. Like, there's more power because there's more interconnection. And so that's something I see happening on the smaller scale, like we were a nonprofit in Oakland, the other one was talking about before, and we partnered with other nonprofits, and that's not uncommon. But when you look at it in a really large scale, it's hard because again, there's not necessarily the resources or the time or the privilege to step back and go, Hmm, let me just see who else is doing this and connect with them?
Rha Goddess 26:28
Well, yeah, it's, I think, to also understand that that like, there, that's a body of work, to connect a field, to build a field to support and provide infrastructure. And and I would also say, Lisa, that one of the reasons why these kind of hybrid models, and more innovative sort of approaches to doing the work are emerging is because so much of what has been the experience, often in traditional nonprofits is that you get lots of money for program, and very little for capacity building. So you get trained to not build infrastructure, you get rewarded, actually, that's, that's another weird way to say it, you get rewarded for not building infrastructure. So you chase programs, because that's where the dollars are. And then when it starts, when you start to look at, well, how much of philanthropic dollars is actually dedicated to capacity building, capacity building within the organization itself, or capacity building within the field? You will be you know what I'm saying? Like you're talking maybe 80/20. Maybe, what it says to you is that when you get grant money, every single dollar is supposed to go out the door. You're not supposed to eat, you're not but the truth of the matter is, if you don't eat none of it's possible. So, you know, there are there are structural ways of being an operating, that are rooted in something much bigger. And that is not about having this work, thrive. Dare I say, but I'm gonna say it.
Lisa Danylchuk 28:24
I mean, I feel like if there weren't, wouldn't it be different, right? Like, there's something you know, there's this sense sometimes of this, like invisible barrier that some someone or something's coming up against, I mean, for myself, as a therapist, sometimes just like, I feel like we keep hitting our head against this wall, and there's something there, but I don't know what it is. So that's kind of the same feeling I get here is, it's not for lack of want, right? I've known so many people in these leadership roles in nonprofits, like they're thinking about how can we be more effective, they're thinking about strategy, but they, to your point, don't have the funding to do that. And so there are structures that are enabling that to say it nicely, right. Yeah,
Rha Goddess 29:07
Yeah. And I think the you know, what I would say if you are a not-for-profit leader listening or part of an organization, where you know, that hustle, you know, that hand-to-mouth hustle really, really well. And you know that you're doing God's work let's just put it let's just call it whether it is right or for Jehovah or whoever, you know, what I mean or source of spirit or the work of love or goddess, however, come on, right? However, you want to describe it. Exactly. You know, you and know that you are an extension of source, energy doing the work in the world. That being really intentional about your model is more imperative than it's ever been, especially as we're architecting and reimagining the world of work. right now and what it means to do work that is meaningful and that matters in the world.
Lisa Danylchuk 30:09
Yeah. So there's some opportunity in the impacts of the pandemic and the shifts that are happening and the things being thrown up in the air, still, at this point for us to continue to reimagine, like, what does this look like moving forward?
Rha Goddess 30:22
Yeah. And to, you know, because I know what the center of this conversation is really about money is to take back our relationship, redefine our relationship with source. Because the resource is an extension of source.
Lisa Danylchuk 30:44
Yes, yes. Oh, my God, quote that, write it down, tweet, all of it, you probably have your like, I've been doing that for lots of years now. But we got to repeat these things to really get them in ourselves. Right? It doesn't happen quickly. It's not I mean, we take on a mantra, and then we gotta live it for a while for it to start to shift. So what's your relationship with money like today? How would you describe that?
Rha Goddess 31:11
I see money as a facilitator. Like a grand facilitator of opportunity, and, of purpose. You know, and I think, because of so much of what we've seen in the world has been the way in which money has harmed has caused harm in the world, or the way that money has been corrupted, or the way that people have been corrupted by money, but you know, get to those six root causes. Here it is. But I see money as a brand facilitator for me, a vision of resource and my intention in life is to be well resourced. And all that I do. And some of that looks like money, and there are other currencies that fall into that but but being well resourced mentally, spiritually, emotionally, physically, financially,
Lisa Danylchuk 32:23
I don't think you're talking about Bitcoin.
Rha Goddess 32:26
You know, cuz who knows what it's gonna be tomorrow, right? You know, so I think this. For me, the that money operates in service of my vision, that money lives as an expression of my love for myself, and for others. And I think that love for myself, peace may be one of the hardest least, right? If we think about where we're coming from this conversation with the nonprofits, right? Because so many of us don't feel we're worthy, or capable, or able. Or that it's available for everybody else, but it's not available for us. You know, as a lot we carry, that stands in the way of our ability to be well resourced.
Lisa Danylchuk 33:26
You're making me think of a couple of clients over the years that have had expressed this thought or feeling like, maybe if something really bad happens to me, then I can rest. Or maybe if I fall off my bike on the way to work, then people will show up for me like to get to that point. And that is, like when you're talking about the self love piece, and the receiving end of being a part of this flow. I'm giving support, but I'm also receiving it I'm also well resourced, like those are moments and people experiencing these moments of really like desperation, right, I have a need, I have a need for people to gather around my bed and tell me that they love me or send cards or flowers or something or have a need to stop and like not go to work for a day or a week. And those are those moments of the lack of the sustainability or the the lack of the resource that you're describing. And that love really like that self. You know, you said so many things in there of the money being something that flows to you flows through you, right, you're you're giving it you're receiving it in that I always think of like the infinity symbol, or there's something really beautiful happening there. And in those other examples, it's out of balance. It's out of whack, right? Something's off.
Rha Goddess 34:45
Yeah. And I want to say that as much as we've been in the conversation of the not-for-profit, this is everywhere.
Lisa Danylchuk 34:52
Yet one of those people was actually working for a very successful corporation that I'm thinking of.
Rha Goddess 34:57
Yeah, I was gonna say this is everywhere. Right, because we've inherited the same kind of conditioning, as to why we go make money, why we are in environments where we're not seen or heard or respected, where we are expected to work 150 hours, right to take on three jobs, you know, to not regard our health, or our families or you know, and I think one of the great things that what I call the sacred pause what many of us call right the pandemic, one of the things that it gave us a reset on was the opportunity to see the degree to which we had put our work our jobs, above everything.
Lisa Danylchuk 35:54
If you're into this podcast, I've got more goodies for you. My audio book yoga for trauma, recovery theory, philosophy and practice just came out on Audible. You can search for my name or for yoga for trauma recovery on the audible app or site and you'll be able to download the free intro there. I'm also offering the first ever live summer training intensive in yoga for Trauma Recovery this summer. Why for to live is for wellness professionals and people seeking to facilitate healing through embodied practices, we'll be able to connect, discussed reflect in real time and practice yoga together for six sessions over three weeks this summer. I'm super excited about this. And I'd love to invite you to join, you can get all the info at how we can heal.com backslash live. That's how we can heal.com/live. So let's talk about the six root causes. So this is in the course, Making Money Making Change. I earmarked it, I bookmarked it, I probably played it. I'm not even kidding. Chapter 12 I probably played it 12 times. Like, again, again, and just like making I was like a really good sandwich or something.
Rha Goddess 37:08
Well, you know, so what are they? What are they? What are what are those causes?
Lisa Danylchuk 37:14
And I just have to say you're articulate, like the ability to articulate them, like, Ah, okay, so you have there's not enough? Yeah, I'm not worthy. Yes. I'm afraid of what it's going to take, that goes back to the 150 Hour Workweek, well, I'm not signing up for that, I will be changed, I'll become someone I don't like, and I've got issues with capitalism, something I want to talk about in there. And then I am not safe. So can you start to break those down for us? And like, how did well first, how did you even get this is through your work that and your own personal work that you came to the thank you for articulating them. Because again, I just have to say, It's so refreshing to hear it sometimes things you're processing in the background in your mind or in your life or with your friends, and then to hear it articulated in a really clear way is just very refreshing. So I get down for us.
Rha Goddess 38:08
Absolutely, thank thank you for saying that. And, and yeah, it's my it was my own journey. And it was what I've observed over 30 years of being on the frontlines of human experience, you know, in terms of what people bump up against, over and over and over I have seen this and so the there is not enough has everything to do with the scarcity conditioning that operates at the heartbeat of our society, our global society, we know this, right? We're, there's so many places where we're taught that there is not enough that you know, some people are going to get and some people aren't going to get you know, and your job is to try to make sure that you are the one that gets or your job is to try to learn how to do without right these are these are the sort of the central messages right. But this there is not enoughness shows up around everything. Time money, love, appreciation, right recognition. You know, we can go on and on and on and on and on and on and on. But this whole idea that no matter what we're addressing, or what we're engaging, that it's in short supply and that underneath it what it means is that is that I will do without I will have to do without because there is not enough, right.
Lisa Danylchuk 39:43
And that in my mind not that I want to scan we could skip ahead and not go through them in order but it makes me think of I'm not safe, right because there's this urgency there's this fear, there's something underneath that's like there's not enough and so I'm not going to be okay, yeah, right. So, I mean they you can tie in and overlap out for sure. The other one I think, are the second one connects to what we've been talking about in terms of that self love piece in terms of I am not worthy, or I don't deserve this or other people get this first before I do. How do you see that one showing up?
Rha Goddess 40:17
Yeah, I think there are ways in which we shun opportunity we shun support, we step around help. And this is what I see every single day. In conversations where our and I want to speak specifically about our willingness to invest in ourselves, is one of the biggest places where we feel no permission. You know, there was a study done by Professor, I believe, based out of Cornell, where she looked at the differences between men having disposable income and what they did with it, versus women having disposable income and what they did with it. And for women, particularly for women who were in families married with children, when then got extra money, it was their money. When women got any semblance of extra money, it was the family's money. And often, it went to the family. And very rarely did it come to them. And the sort of the findings of the report is sort of bottom line findings, the report was that women are not prone to invest in themselves, not prone to put themselves first when it comes to resourcing. Right? And being resourced. And I would add people of color, like, you know, we can go there are a lot of different you know, if we look at class, we there are a lot of different you all places where we can enter into this conversation and would find the correlation, right? similarities. And certainly, if you have more than one of these intersecting identities, it's exacerbated this, this question of worthiness. And whether or not you deserve to have better,
Lisa Danylchuk 42:23
and I think with that about just what's reflected to us, what we grew up seeing everything we take in with our, all of our senses, through our eyes, like, all the messages we get there in terms of belonging, like, Where do I belong? And what's me and what's not me and those kind of developmental tasks that, you know, we do sort of figure out a template at some point in our, in our brains, and then we go, Wait, what's that doing in there? And where did that come from? And so that's where I feel like the, the real personal work, like, like you've done and you support other people in doing is, is a big part of making larger change, right, because it's internalized a lot of this and, and that carries it forward just as much as, as, I mean, maybe even more. But, you know, once things are internalized, it's, it's in there, and we've got to do the work to see it, to work with it to, to name it, and then to move forward, hopefully, in a clearer way to cleanse, cleanse some of that.
Rha Goddess 43:22
Yeah. And I think that to know that, you know, these show up when you're succeeding, cuz I think people feel like, oh, fail, you know, when I'm failing, this is all of what's going on with me. Right? But they show up equally. And dare I even say maybe, in some cases, even more intensified when you are succeeding,
Lisa Danylchuk 43:48
because they're the little invisible barrier that you're coming up against. So so when you're, you can hear them, maybe when you feel like your whatever not succeeding is, but then once you really come up against that barrier, that boundary, that message internally, it gets louder, right, you're right up next to it, who do you think you are? And all those those things?
Rha Goddess 44:09
Yeah. And we, you know, we find ways to, you know, miss the appointment or drop the ball or not follow up or follow through or find, you know, other justifications for why we don't step into the opportunities and, and those are all at a core level, often. The message of I'm not worthy, that's awkward
Lisa Danylchuk 44:33
thing. It's a huge part of entrepreneurship, too, right? Because if one person or a group is coming together, like we're gonna hit those barriers if we're trying to grow into suffering.
Rha Goddess 44:44
100%
Lisa Danylchuk 44:46
So what about I'm afraid of what it's going to take?
Rha Goddess 44:50
This was a big one for me, as well, I think we have been sold a mythology about success that you know, hardware can sacrifice hard work and sacrifice all the time, all the time, all the time, all the time, all the time, all the time, and only a few of us are going to make it. So if you wanted to make it, you better be prepared to just work all the time, be prepared to do you know, so there's that piece of it. The other strand of it, is this idea of making it and maintaining it. And what is it going to require of me to maintain it? Once I get it like, okay, I can get there. But can I maintain it? And this is that conversation about, you know, am I willing to work 18 hours a day? Am I willing to never see my kids Am I willing to? So this is about the trade, and what we're what we have been taught we have to trade in order to be successful.
Lisa Danylchuk 46:00
Some of the most important things, family time with your family, like what do people say on their deathbed, right? Like, what do people want?
Rha Goddess 46:10
Yes, work that you love. I. So I think there's there's a real reckoning that goes on, when we look at, you know, what we've been indoctrinated to believe is necessary. You know, now the studies in science are coming out, like, the truth is, you're only really good for about four hours a day.
Lisa Danylchuk 46:33
In like 90 minute chunks, you know
Rha Goddess 46:34
what I'm saying right now, right? And then if you really, if you really go into high performance is 45, you know, right. And then you need to run around for 10 minutes. So you know what I'm saying? So but but the I think these old schools of thought, these old paradigms and ways of operating and being and the ways in which we've been indoctrinated to push and force this what it's going to take and and that at the heart of the conversation, because hard work is one, but at the heart of the conversation is this question of who I am? And what I think is going to be required of me? And do I feel like I have it in me to do what I think is going to be required of
Lisa Danylchuk 47:16
me. You're talking about force. And I think about you know, yoga, having been a yoga teacher for so long. And like what happens when we force things, something breaks, we injure ourselves, right? I know, teachers who have been demonstrating something and injured themselves because they were like, come on body, just do it. Right, instead of listening and tuning and knowing our needs. So it's like that level of energy. There's always a QA, like there's a cost at a certain point. And I don't know that we know that as a collective, like, we just push and push and push and think this is the way this is the way and there's harm a lot of the time in that too.
Rha Goddess 47:57
And I think again, this is the relearning, this has a inviting in new messages and new perspectives, because we don't only get it personally, but we get it societally. There are things that get modeled in our culture that tell us that this is what we should be, quote unquote, doing. And so, you know, I think the I'm afraid of what it's going to take has a lot to do with that.
Lisa Danylchuk 48:23
Yeah. And then what about I will be changed?
Rha Goddess 48:27
Yeah, this is the the concern of being corrupted. And the concern of being perceived as being corrupted, that somehow success is defined as compromising oneself. And again, we've got a lot of anecdotal experience, if we look at right, the narratives around success and getting to the top and what it means and how people supposedly change. And I remember being in a very profound and intimate conversation with someone really, really accomplished and well known in the world. And they said to me, that, you know, when you succeed, you don't change the people around you change. But they see you different, you know, and I thought that that was fascinating, right? You know, this idea that you know, that they are still the same person. But there's all this perception that gets heaped on them about who they must be now and how they're this is the sellout conversation you all right, you sold your soul or, you know, or you abandoned your people or it's all those things and those are very real and deep conversations for people and this abandoning your people, this is also part of what's I'm afraid of what it might take. So we the hard work, but also that you can't hang around the people that you used to hang around with or you can't be a part of, right because after all, if you really want to be successful So this is really where you need to be in the corrupted part is that your values compromised, or that you'll be perceived as having had your values compromised. And for people who feel deeply identify, which is most of us with our values, that's a non starter.
Lisa Danylchuk 50:25
And I'm just thinking of how that prevents access to resources, right? We're talking about this as, as resource as support as facilitating possibility. And it's like, well, I don't want to be changed. I don't want to step away from my group, I don't want to be seen as different. So I'll stay here, where maybe there's less possibility, there's less freedom, there's less choice because me I think about being ostracized or not belonging is such a huge fear for so many good reasons, right. And so how easy that could keep not just one of us, but a whole group of us, if we're kind of agreeing to the same norms and values, it could just keep us from having what we need.
Rha Goddess 51:11
when I got or having more support. 100%. When I got to the heart of that conversation for myself, what I realized was that I because of that conversation, did not believe that I could trust myself more. did not believe that I could trust myself with more. That was a very humbling moment, for me, really life changing. moment when I was like, Well, what is it that I believe about myself? That I think that I can't be trusted with?
Lisa Danylchuk 51:46
That'll shake you right there. And it takes a while to dig deep enough to find that one, right? That's like hidden under a lot of these other things that are really easy to sort of dust off or justify or, you know, see it in a helpful light.
Rha Goddess 52:04
Yeah. Because you think that that one's about everybody else, like, Oh, they're right there, they're corrupt, or they're, you know what I mean? But the but really what we're seeing underneath that is I'm afraid that I'm going to be corrupt. So I better not touch that. Or I better not lean into that or not embrace that.
Lisa Danylchuk 52:22
I'll become that thing.
Rha Goddess 52:24
I'll become that thing that I judge or I see.
Lisa Danylchuk 52:27
So that leads us nicely into I've got issues with capitalism, and I heard this one and I was like, Oh, I don't know. And then, you know, you went on with it. I mean, yeah, I was like, I wouldn't put it that way. And then here's what you said, I want to serve a population or community that cannot afford me, but really needs what I have to offer. And I can't afford to give it to them for free. And I was like, Oh, my God, that one, like, right in the heart. And then the next part you said was, so I'm angry at capitalism. And so I was like, I wouldn't have like before, you know, cracking this course, said, I'm angry at capitalism, like, Yeah, I'm not super happy with it. But it's not something I personally like harp on just because there's so many things in my brain and so many places to go. So I wouldn't have expressed it that way. But when you said, and I'll say it again, I want to serve a population or community that cannot afford me, but really needs what I have to offer. And I can't afford to give it to them for free. I was like, Oh, you just labeled my struggle bus. Of the last I don't know of like, I guess that's like a 10 year struggle, but I feel like I was on and still like listening to it. I was like, Oh, yes, like, wouldn't the amount of times I've thought, what if I could just make a really good living and keep doing this nonprofit work and keep doing exactly what I'm doing keeps showing up in juvenile halls keep showing up in communities that that don't have the resources to pay me directly. Wouldn't that be nice? So talk about this one. Tell us you'll just keep it up for you.
Rha Goddess 54:06
I mean, I think this is the act of this anthem, quite frankly. You know what I mean, I think, I think so much of when we go to do good in the world, we are wanting to serve the least resourced. I am the most as we perceive those who really need the work the most. And they're not well resourced, and we're not in a position where we're resourced enough to be able to not have to worry about it. Right. And this is this is the bridge that we hope that philanthropy helps us close but we all know that those gaps are large for lots and lots of reasons and it has nothing to do with there not being enough. That's been proven false, right. But I do want to say that that that is I'm coming to grips with that, that especially the second part of it, because we kind of like, okay, there are people who need my work, but they can't afford it. What really is the rub is, I can't afford to do it for free. Why I can't afford to do so. Right. So now that puts me in a situation where I'm, there's this tension between what I really want to be doing what I believe I should be doing what I believe I'm called to be doing, and what I'm actually able to do, given my capacity.
Lisa Danylchuk 55:35
And a little bit of victimization in there for me personally, of like, that's so unfair, right? That's the angry, so I'm angry at capitalism, like, That's so unfair, because other people have passions that they can be sustained by, right. And so I feel like I have to name that because it's like a real sticky undercurrent to, I think, getting stuck in this one.
Rha Goddess 55:57
Yeah, and the perception that every this is back to the like, everybody else can, but not me, it's possible for them, but it's not possible for me, you know. And I think, to your point, because when we do the frontline work, what we see is such a breakdown, and I'm being you know, I'm trying to find the words, you all here, because breakdown is a really, really gentle way to say what we experience is a wheel, faltering of our social fabric, or real rip or shredding of our social fabric, when we look at the conditions that some people have to live in and operate in, and right beside them, see other people having everything, you know, somebody throwing out a steak dinner, and somebody you know, who wishes they had, you know, do you understand what I'm saying, right, or even a quarter of a hamburger to throw away? And so, when you see that kind of disparity side by side, right? it becomes very difficult to, to not feel some kind of way. Right about our current system. And so, you know, my challenge with that one was, I realized that being an anti capitalist was not a vision. Hmm, that's the hard part. Right? So being anti anything you are, I'm just saying it's not efficient. I, I had to be willing to come up with what is a viable alternative for me.
Lisa Danylchuk 57:36
And it's so important to think about what is the vision? You know, in in Oakland nearby here, there have been stores that put up these stickers that say we're united against hate? And I'm like, that's good. What are you united for? Like, can you can you put that sticker up? At least as well? Like, can we put them side by side? So are you united? For love, for acceptance for equality? What is it? But can we express that as well, at minimum, right? Because I do feel like we can get really pulled into a push pull and a fight that doesn't really go anywhere. If we don't have some sense of what it is we actually want, or what would be
Rha Goddess 58:20
good. The challenge with that statement. And we talk about this a lot when entrepreneurs come into our work. And with the crowd, the challenge with that statement, is that hatred still has to exist in order for that statement to be viable. And so we create the self fulfilling prophecy of what we say we don't want, right? We have because we've embedded it in our vision.
Lisa Danylchuk 58:41
The word is right next to the door handle, I'm going into the US bookstore and opening the door and I'm seeing hatred, right? I mean, I think a lot about language and words and what what we choose and what we say to ourselves and other people. And so that that stands out to me, because it's like, how does it feel when we just read and intake a word or hear a word? What how does that resonate in our bodies? What Does it perpetuate, even, to take it further.
Rha Goddess 59:06
In my book, The Calling, I go even deeper, you know, I touch it and making money making change. And then in The Calling, I go even deeper around this idea of personal economy, you know that we have an opportunity to really be guided by our values. When we start to look at the way in which we want to operate in terms of how we earn, how we save, how we invest, how we spend, and that that each of us on an individual level can begin to take our power back. When we start to go okay, well, how do I want to make my money? In what ways feel really honorable for me and how I want to show up, right? How do I want to spend my money I remember the shift that I had. And again, I talked about this in The Calling. The shift that I had that really enabled me to actively and intentionally be willing to make a lot of money came from the idea that I could actually transform economy. Because and I, you know, least I will, I'm gonna go on and live here. But I would imagine like making a whole lot of money for the sake of making a whole lot of money. Most people get so excited about that, you know, when I think about, especially when I think about people who have a deep passion for wanting to make a difference in the world, and really, really wanting to help people, like you're not, you're not looking to stack money for money's sake. You know what I mean? Right? And so, you know, I say that, because I used to go to those trainings. And, you know, they would want to get you really amped up about making a whole bunch of money. And I'm just like, yeah, it's, I mean, I get it, I do get it, I do get it, I swear, y'all. But it's never going to be something that's going to drive me given who my parents were, and given what I come from, and given what I've seen. But this idea of reimagining economy in a way where more people can thrive and prosper. I'm excited about that. You know what I mean? I want to make a way for that I'm willing to be resourced in the name of that. And this is what I mean, when I say our opportunity to have a vision is what enables us to shift or transform. Those challenges we have with capitalism.
Lisa Danylchuk 1:01:38
it makes me think of actually a nonprofit that's in Kenya. In Nairobi Africa yoga project I worked with, volunteered with for some time, and they have a model of, you know, obviously, their fundraising and all of that, but they train they're there. They offer yoga classes, and then they train yoga teachers who then can go out and, you know, have a well paying job in the community offering yoga. And so these things that have, like, I feel like that's a little piece of what you're describing here. Like, where's there a true sense of empowerment and of systemic change? And, like, I feel it like a, like a shift that clicks, right? And you're like, ah, there it is, that feels so much better.
Rha Goddess 1:02:21
And you go from, you know, in this personal economy conversation, there's, there's so much to unpack, but you go from being mad about spending your money to being excited. You know what I mean? Like, I want to put it there. Right? Yeah, wow, I get to invest in this corner bakery. That's like the third generation. And you know what I mean, and they're bringing these ancient recipes from their corner of the world. And, you know, they're up four o'clock every morning, rolling the dough, fret, like, yes, take all my money. Do you know what I mean? Right. And I think it's like, wow, if we could think about, and it's so beautiful, because I know, in the Oakland Community, that's so much of a part of the ethos, right, of what I've experienced, we think about people's grocery shop people's grocery, or some of the other communities and ventures that have been built in those communities. And so this idea of like, wow, every time I spend my dollar, could I be thankful? Could I be inspired? Could I be fired up? I love supporting new entrepreneurs. I love giving them business, you know, and our opportunity to see that and again, embrace the power that can be associated with moving our dollars in alignment with our values.
Lisa Danylchuk 1:03:43
And that's such a moment of connection, right? I'm giving this you know, whatever it is $10 for bread to a person that I value, and I care about, and I want to invest in, you know what, like, the bride fell on the floor, let me buy another one because I don't want you to be out, right. Like that kind of level of, of interpersonal connection. And, and again, like coming back to that image of webbing, right? Like we are connected and we value each other and the feeling of that, versus some of the other things we felt. And that leads nicely I want to make sure we don't forget the last one even though I mentioned it earlier if I'm not safe, right. Because when we have those connections, we inherently feel safer. It's kind of like if you're in I don't know say you're like in a rental you're in a new place are traveling and if the house is empty, and it's like really big, it feels weird, right? You feel like less safe. Whereas if there's people you know, or there's you know, a family feel like it just inherently feels like you can settle in a little bit more.
Rha Goddess 1:04:43
It's a sense of connection. The I am not safe root cause here that I really point to is rooted in trauma. Where for many of us having attention at a very young age wound up being a very negative experience. And certainly we live in a society that has a very well established habit of building people up and then ripping them down, you know, or people get something and then they become prone to attack. And so people don't aspire, people don't reach, because they're concerned that if they do, then that they'll be preyed upon in a very particular way. I remember having a conversation used to host his community meditations. And I remember a woman we did want on money one time, and I remember one come up to me, and she said, You know, I want to aspire to more. But I know that the minute it looks like I'm progressing, my family is going to be all over me about why I'm not supporting them. And while I'm not in it can be exhausting. And so because I don't want that pressure, or I don't want to feel that guilt, or that sense of obligation. I don't, I don't reach. I don't push. And that's a, you know, a translation of it's not safe. It's not okay. Somebody's gonna be upset if I succeed. And therefore, let me let me not right, right, let me know. Well, I mean, Martin Luther King, I mean, this is what we're talking about. Right. This is what we're talking about, right that you become prey. And that way, and so we have to work through that for for those of us who have this persecution, this fear of persecution, that shows up really deeply for us, like places and spaces to be able to really work through that.
Lisa Danylchuk 1:06:50
And when you give those examples, it illustrates how you know, real, that experiential trauma is right. Like seeing that happen. I went with an ex of mine, my boyfriend and in grad school to where Martin Luther King was buried, and He was a social worker, and he was just crying the whole time. You know? And I think this is a lot of it of like that. How can this happen to someone who's who's doing something so powerful? And this is what I want to do? And how can I do it? Like, how could I ever right? So yeah, that safety is big. And I think it is really rooted in trauma. So thank you for naming that. You know, I wanted to talk a little bit about your, your TED talk, but I don't know if we have time, and I want to make sure you can finish the thought you were just having to so go ahead with that.
Rha Goddess 1:07:44
No, just that I think that the safety piece that this idea of how do we begin to develop a sense of safety inside of ourselves as part of the work, you know, and again, like I go deep on these six pieces in the work that I do with leaders in various configurations and constellations. But I do want to speak to the safety piece, because I think so many people, especially coming out of the last two years, they so right, hack, if we look at just, you know, in the at the time of this taping, you know, we look at we just came out of a weekend of two instances of mass shootings, right, rooted in identity. And I think that this idea of how we start to cultivate a sense of safety and a sense of belonging within ourselves, is part of the next frontier, in terms of the work that we're here to do, you know, and the degree to which we can start to build that capacity within ourselves in terms of doing that healing work, is the degree to which we grow that capacity to be able to create that and be that for others. So this is kind of where we are right now.
Lisa Danylchuk 1:08:58
Do you want to say I don't want to be quick with your TED Talk? Because it's such a rich topic. I mean, we'd love to have you back on if you want to just come back on anytime open invitation. Want to just at least for folks that are listening, speak to the topic a little bit. So you're talking about redefining power at work to include women of color, and I believe it's Deepa.
Rha Goddess 1:09:17
purshottam and shut them and my beloved partner shout out diva. Yeah, what I would say is that, you know, we've been, again, talking sort of in the in the context of not for profit, we've been talking in sort of the context of being a change agent and sort of navigating that space. But I would also say that we know that this operates in corporations, we know that this operates in our society. And I think our society is really looking in a new way and renegotiating in a very, very new way, and asking itself in very real time. What should the vision the future of work look like? That's not just about technology. But it's about how we as people at the very core rehumanize, and how we learn how to work together, how to see one another how to be together, how to work together. And so this TED talk is really rooted in the experiences understanding the experiences of women of color, which in some cases are quite unique to maybe what others are experiencing in the workplace. But it comes back to the same conversations that we've been engaged in today, which is really, about how do we create systems, structures, paradigms, communities, ecosystems, where every single one of us can show up as our full selves, and thrive and prosper, where there can be love and dignity and respect and appreciation, and valuing of who we are and what we bring. And I think that that's at the core of the work. And what I want you all to know, is, is like, that's our work with us and us. Because we've inherited a lot of stuff that does not belong to us about who we are and who we're not about what we're capable of, and what we're not capable of. And so the most sacred and holy work that we can do is with us and us, because that is the primary relationship that we are having with us and us. And as we build and learn how to grow and nurture and care for ourselves, we have more capacity to then be able to do that out in the wall.
Lisa Danylchuk 1:11:32
Absolutely. You know, it's going to ask what advice you would have for women of color? Or I don't know, it might be a different angle for non binary, folks. But if if you want to step into roles of power,
Rha Goddess 1:11:45
like Yeah, I think it's I think it's really recognizing what your vision is, you know, because I think regardless of orientation, a lot of people put their hands on power, and they're not clear. They're not clear about what they're being driven by or guided by. And this is actually the next book that's coming, Lisa. We'll get there. But I'm just literally you all just pretend to pay for one second book now. But it's all about ambition. And it's all about being able to understand what we get driven by? And in what ways are we operating from wounded ambition versus true ambition? And how do we make those distinctions? And how do we understand that and so that is our work. Because if we want to leave, if we do want to truly make the world better, we do have to be operating in service of a vision. And we have to be willing to do the inner work. You know, this sort of, I love the work of William Ury. And we, we've had the privilege, William is one of my homies, and I've had the honor and the privilege of working with him and supporting his leadership, but also having him in our space and in our community and talking to our folks. And he talks about the work of the three sides, and there's the inner work, then there's the interpersonal work, then there's communal work. And his observation of these three sides actually came from being in I believe it was Mozambique, and watching a tribe resolve its conflicts. And actually being able to extrapolate the process of watching the way they resolve conflicts for going all well, there's three sides, there's your personal work that you need to do, or you need a piece of go to the balcony is the way he describes it, right? And then there's the interpersonal work that needs to happen, like in other words, the two people who are in the conflict, but then there's the community that's been impacted by the conflict, and how does the community realign itself in support of the resolution? Right, and we think of it now, in the context of the work that we're doing is we're saying it's the inner work. It's the interpersonal work, right, which is the work of culture, and then it's the structural work, the systemic work, and how do we go to work on the ecosystems that have these kinds of disparities baked in?
Lisa Danylchuk 1:14:15
I love the vision that you're describing to in all of that, like, a lot of what you've just said, it's like it gives you somewhere to go. Right? It gives you there's a light there at the end of the tunnel.
Rha Goddess 1:14:29
To women of color and our binary folks and other folks just who are listening like you know that this your time. Your time, we're in an incredible moment where I think we some more of us are being asked to influence the reshaping and the reimagining of our world of our future of where we're going, whether you're doing that as a healer, and you're bringing yoga into corporations, or whether you're stepping into other kinds of institutions and circles and you're carrying your gifts And what I want to say to you is that all internal healing work, our preparatory work, our realigning with purpose, and calling our clarity of vision, and desired impact, that that work is just as important as anything else we may have done externally to get the opportunity. And we want to be really clear, when we take our seats, what will be different?
Lisa Danylchuk 1:15:28
So it was like to wrap up by asking what gives you hope.
Rha Goddess 1:15:31
I think this moment for me, I think you give me hope. All of the people who are listening to this conversation, give me hope, because I believe that we're all sifting and sorting right now, trying to get to our own truths about what we're going to, you know, allow and tolerate and have and not have, and whether that's the two hour each way commute, or whether that's flexible time, so we can live up on our babies while we get our work done. Or, you know, all of the things that I feel like we're standing for right now, you know, post this great resignation, is what gives me hope, because we have the opportunity if we stay awake at the wheel, to really re architect and reimagine how this is done. Our Watch ah, this is our watch our time.
Lisa Danylchuk 1:16:23
I love it. And I know you're putting pen to paper and you're continuing to just flow things through, I have to say, I feel so much depth in what you're saying there's, I can really feel that you've done so much internal digging and deep work. And then the clarity that comes with being able to articulate that. I just have a lot of appreciation for that. So thank you so much. And I feel the love that's pouring through this. And I think it's so important to have these conversations around, how does that relate to money? How does how do we build healthier, healthy economies? Right and more inclusive and dignified interactions and more, you know, true interconnection, and true moments of valuing each other. So thank you, how can people connect with you read your books.
Rha Goddess 1:17:18
Thank you, thank you so much, Lisa, just for the space that you create. And for the people that you impact has been my joy to be here. And then in terms of how people can find me. So on social at Rha Goddess, and it's R-H-A Goddess. And then also, you know, I have to always come very gifts. And so we do want to share the resources of The Calling, which is the book three fundamental shifts to stay true, get paid, do good. And you can get it on all of the major platforms shout out St. Martin's Press. But also, we're going to share a link to our resources page where you those are free, you can come in and just, you know input, your name, your email, you'll get all access to all of the tools and the tips and the worksheets. Because, again, Lisa, to your point, how do we make this concrete? How do we make this real, and then the Making Money Making Change, which is part of my collaboration with sounds to shout out the True family. And that you can get on Audible as well as The Calling on Audible if you preferred an audible format. But those are all available to you.
Lisa Danylchuk 1:18:22
I love some audiobooks. And I've said this earlier, I don't think we were recording yet. But I love that you laugh in making money making change. And I just like there's just moments where you're laughing at yourself. You're laughing with the commentary, you're just go and I'm like, man, like I just recorded my audiobook and I was like, Why didn't I laugh in there? Like what? Like, come on, it's just so it's such a different experience to have that. So yeah, thank you for that. And I encourage people to you know, follow you and listen to what you're saying and absorb the love and share the love and just keep it going. Because I know you said your name is a very powerful, you know, representation for you and you try to live up to it. But I'm like strut. You do it. You are living up to that. So thank you
Rha Goddess 1:19:06
Thank you so much truly, Lisa for having me and for all this incredible work that you do and congratulations on your new book.
Lisa Danylchuk 1:19:16
Literally uploading it to Audible like as we speak.
Rha Goddess 1:19:20
I cannot wait to dig in.
Lisa Danylchuk 1:19:24
Thank you so much. Rha and I do hope we can
Rha Goddess 1:19:26
My pleasure. Thank you again.
Lisa Danylchuk 1:19:30
Thanks so much for listening. My hope is that you walk away from these episodes feeling supported, and like you have a place to come to find the hope and inspiration you need to take your next small step forward. For more information and resources, please visit howwecanheal.com There you'll find tons of helpful resources and the full transcript of each show. Thanks so much for your messages, feedback and ideas about the podcast. I love hearing from you and I so appreciate your support. There are lots of ways you can support the show and I'm grateful for every little bit of love you share. If you love the show, please leave us a review on Apple, Spotify, Audible or wherever you get your podcasts. You can also subscribe on YouTube to get updates every week. You can always visit howwecanheal.com/podcast to share your thoughts and ideas I love hearing from you. So keep your comments coming. If you'd like to stay connected in between episodes, you can also text me text the word heal to 888-858-0811. That's 888-858-0811. That number has a lot of eights in it. I'll send you some inspiration and support a few times a month and you can text me back there too. Before we wrap up, I want to be clear that this podcast isn't offering any prescriptions. It's not advice or any kind of diagnosis. Your decisions are in your hands. And we encourage you to consult with any relevant health care professionals you may need to support you through your unique path of healing. I'd also like to send thanks to our guests today to Christine O'Donnell and Celine Baumgartner of Bright Sighted Podcasting, and to everyone who helps support this podcast directly and indirectly. Alex, thanks for taking the dogs out while I record. Last week, I'd love to give a shout-out to my big brother man who passed away in 2002. He wrote this music and it makes my heart so happy to share it with you now.
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